T O P

Can we stop talking about Old. Money vs. New Money ?

Can we stop talking about Old. Money vs. New Money ?

[deleted]

To be quite frank, none of them are “old money.” Even Kathy married into it. When it comes to Beverly Hills I think it’s more real money vs pretend money.


GarnierFruitTrees

^this. Any new money vs old money convos on BH are just distractions from actual money vs no money at all


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GarnierFruitTrees

And I know BH is supposed to be lifestyle porn or whatever but I think it has gone a little too far in depth. It makes me cringe when they are like “OmG how rich ARE you~?!?!” Like, ugh. It feels so icky to me especially in 2021. Like just shut your mouth


Interesting-Wasabi-6

Tinsley is the only one I can think of.


Macadamic

Adrienne Maloof


Wadsworth1954

Kathy married into it, so did Kyle and Kim, but their mom was pretty much a professional gold digger. So I wouldn’t necessarily call them “old money”, but they grew up in Los Angeles with rich daddies and Kim’s child actor money.


KarenD2016

Yep, I was just going to say the same thing.


pbj4evaplzty

Aren’t all the women on BH new money anyways? Crystal and Sutton would both be considered new money so of course there is no difference lol


MGoBlue22

Yeah, between Sutton and Crystal which one is supposed to be old money?


oveofsta

People say Sutton’s family had money back in Georgia, but no proof or verification. Something like she came from a “good family”.


pbj4evaplzty

I think they were pretty solidly upper middle class. Her mom as a teacher and her dad an architect.


littleoysterz

does Crystal have any of her own money? or is it all the husbands?


sunny_deee

Husband’s, at least initially. In an interview, Crystal talked about growing up middle class in the Valley. Via her husband, she was able to start a coconut water company that apparently sells at Costco.


Messyhairandsweats

I have to tell you I started reading in my Moira Rose voice when I got to "meagerly proletariat wages" and forgot what I was reading about. I know it does not do anything for conversation but I needed someone to know... ![gif](giphy|l3V0sznnlbP7w80Ra)


UrbanPlannerholic

LOL!


linzness

I find the difference fascinating. The lifestyles of the rich are already fascinating to watch. Learning about the history of their wealth is even more to me. And I don’t think one is better than the other, a millionaire is a millionaire


ErikasCasita

There’s a definite difference. They may all have money but old money holds more clout. Just the holding the name of a family that is old money opens doors faster than new money. Example: Carnegie vs Musk They are not the same.


lucygucyapplejuicey

This was best shown in Dallas. That’s why I loved Dallas. I didn’t know who the hell the families were, but I would ask my dad and he’d be like “ohhhhh them” and anyway just the whole “protect the image” thing is so fascinating to me. Then Dallas Dallas’d 😐


psy-ay-ay

You honestly think Elon Musk has less access or clout than the Carnegies of today? The Carnegies don’t even have wealth today so not sure what doors are open for them


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psy-ay-ay

I mean the Carnegies of today go to public schools and work regular white collar jobs. I think the only tangible piece of the family legacy they have left is Cumberland island which they have to rent as a bed and breakfast and are probably going to lose that soon. The are not sitting on boards of the Carnegie Corporation What doors are being opened for them? What access do they have that Elon musk doesn’t?


jojoju2000

Carnegie was considered New Money for his time. New Money and Old Money are just words thrown around so that older richer Americans can feel good about themselves.


ErikasCasita

But he’s not new money now. That’s the point. At some point some families/ people establish themselves as part of the main thread of a country or their community. The Queen of ~~England~~ United Kingdom is old money. Old money means they’ve had their money quiet a bit longer. Through generation. It’s how they utilize it and the longevity of their success and those they have connected with and things that come from it. Old money is wealth beyond your imagination. New money is spending $40k on a glam squad. Old money is still getting your breakfast at McDonald’s even though you’re a billionaire. New money is Caviar everyday. There is vast difference. Sutton’s family is most likely old money because that’s how her history reads.


ElyseSlaine

Old money also means there’s a good chance their family owned slaves.


LZAtotheMZA

THAT PART


xxawayfromhere

and NOW we've said it


ErikasCasita

Yea it does. That includes places all over the world for centuries. That doesn’t change how it’s defined.


ElyseSlaine

Especially from the southern US. 😉


ErikasCasita

Especially all over the world. Slavery is still a thing.


ElyseSlaine

We’re talking about Americans here, sweetie.


ErikasCasita

No we’re talking about terms.


queen_of_england_bot

>Queen of England Did you mean the [Queen of the United Kingdom](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queen_of_the_United_Kingdom), the [Queen of Canada](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monarchy_of_Canada), the [Queen of Australia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monarchy_of_Australia), etc? The last Queen of England was [Queen Anne](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anne,_Queen_of_Great_Britain) who, with the 1707 Acts of Union, dissolved the title of King/Queen of England. ####FAQ *Isn't she still also the Queen of England?* This is only as correct as calling her the Queen of London or Queen of Hull; she is the Queen of the place that these places are in, but the title doesn't exist. *Is this bot monarchist?* No, just pedantic. I am a bot and this action was performed automatically.


ErikasCasita

Good bot


jojoju2000

Thanks I guess ?


spaghettisabel

Bad bot


psy-ay-ay

This is some really romanticized viewpoint. And old money/new money where do you draw the line? How many generations? What year? It’s so arbitrary.


jojoju2000

Also that's just a bunch of stereotypes. Many Old Money Folks eat Caviar. So do New Money folks. Many New money folks eat Pizza so do Old Money folks. There is such a wide range of people's, you can't pigeon hole them.


ErikasCasita

It’s not a stereotype. You’ve never heard of Warren Buffet?


sweetfaced

Warren Buffett isn’t old money at all but I think you’re differentiating between conservative and ostentatious rich people which can be old or new money and is dependent on region, field, family status etc etc


spaghettisabel

People are so ridiculous. All tech billionaires are new money, that’s literally what new money means


jojoju2000

Warren Buffett is NEW Money. He gained all his wealth through financial investing. The Old Old Old Money Families of America have shrunk in actual wealth because it's so dispersed now. John Kerry I would say is a real example of Old Old Money. He probably eats caviar when he wants. But he's connected with the Forbes, and Dudely Winthrop Families, attended Yale and got inducted into the very secretive skull and bones society.


BrunoTheCat

That's actually an interesting point because he has the pedigree and background but a lot of his actual wealth comes from his wife. (My uncle was the Kerrys' neighbor in Boston for YEARS and his favorite story was when they tried to throw their weight around and were total dicks to get some fire hydrants moved and got super huffy when literally no one in the neighborhood association was impressed. I've always liked that because it's a prefect example of how money really can't buy everything.)


jojoju2000

Ehh. Kerry himself apparently holds 100 million dollars in trust funds.


BrunoTheCat

Yeah, that's a good point. Neither of them are certainly hurting for walking around money. I've just always gotten the sense that his stuff is mostly locked up in family endowments and such and she's worth something like $1B so I figure that she's their source of liquid capital.


SchmonkeyCat

“Well, Andrew Carnegie is dead. So that’s difficult.”


vancity-chick

That’s not OP’s point. Okay sure look at their history all you want but to say they are BETTER than someone else because of their family is weird and classist. Weird how everyone is mad at Crystal and Kathy for being classist but they can do it themselves


Perfect_Invitation1

Agreed! I love discussions of wealth on here because there are so many different perspectives and a lot of information I never considered but the recent tone has been disappointing.


MGoBlue22

Saying people with old money are superior to those with new money is infinitely snobbier and more classist than saying you’ve never heard of someone at your country club.


starchildx

No, you're absolutely right. There are gross comments on the subject. There are also not gross comments on the subject which are usually people who want to understand the nuances of being a human in a society. I think the former are the people who read certain brands of comments that get a lot of attention and then they just repeat the essence of that comment with no heart. So on every single thread about Fake Donn now we get the requisite comment "I don't care what anybody says Fake Donn is real Donn rofl" and on posts about Sutton a hollow comment pointing out new money vs old money which they just read somewhere else. And it feels real icky and shallow.


jojoju2000

Also; Old Money doesn't mean crap. Just ask me about my own family history. It doesn't matter once you come to a new country.


notdorisday

Agreed. It’s a very Anglo centric term when it’s used here.


starchildx

Hey tell me about your family history. 🙂


jojoju2000

My family was really Old Money in Vietnam. Like This is not exaggerating but like I had High ranking Military officers, Landowners, Tea Barons, Teachers ( Teachers were upper class in Vietnam ), both of my grandfathers were educated at French Schools hence their ability to speak French. And then after 1975, when the New Government took over, all of it was destroyed. Both of my grandfathers were sent to Re education camps because of their high social status. So now you know why it doesn't matter to me anymore. It's just money.


2ndSeasonHousewife

Yes, my husband is a political asylum refugee who also came from “Old Money,” until the communists decided that their land, hacienda, businesses and friends were all property of the state. They escaped because they had wealth and connections, but with the shirts on their backs.


jojoju2000

In America, you’re not old or new money anymore. You’re just another refugee. Another migrant. So does it really matter ?


judgementforeveryone

How horrible. I’m sorry both ppl here on this post went thru this. I’m sure there were many others at that time too.


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jojoju2000

Well some of my cousins are attending Ivy a league universities now so…….


starchildx

I’m truly at a loss for words. ❤️


jojoju2000

So I don’t need to research about Old Money. I literally am one ish. And you know what ? When you come to a new country, it doesn’t matter.


jojoju2000

I would be more surprised if a member of the Roosevelt’s were to do reality tv.


ErikasCasita

It’s really a pretty specific critique of Sutton who is the foil of Erika not a general put down of anyone who has recently earned their wealth.


vancity-chick

Man I’m not sure why you’re defending these rich people so much. They’re not gunna come knock on your door and thank you. They’re gunna continue to fuck us all over by hoarding wealth.


ErikasCasita

I’m not defending anyone. It’s purely about how a term is defined. Feel free to do your own due diligence.


davidthomvs

This is so disingenuous. We don’t see anything about the “history of their wealth” on the show. New money is just thrown around as a classist pejorative.


FundamentalBasic

True. If someone says “she’s new money “ it’s code for she’s ostentatious, gauche, unrefined or ill mannered.


notdorisday

Yup. It’s put down based on something so asinine and also - within our society - something so likely to be defined along some very specific racial lines. Honestly I don’t care if someone’s money is old or new - I care that wealth in general disproportionate and we have people working for tips, living in poverty, without health insurance, with no ability to save for their future - and then we have people who can live so absurdly and it’s NOT down to who works hardest, its just not - it’s not down to who earned their money - people who are working minimum wage jobs are working damn hard.


Shock_Beautiful

> New money is just thrown around as a classist pejorative. Ding ding ding. New money is less likely to have been made off of actual slavery, pretty-much-like-slavery working conditions of the industrial age, literal theft of land and exploitation of tenants over generations, etc. so frankly, depending how you got it, new money is better. Like people sitting around being all snotty about Sutton maybe having old Southern money...seriously? That old Southern money ain't clean and it ain't classy.


ErikasCasita

Most money isn’t clean and stems from some form of exploitation hence them being able to make such a swift profit.


spaghettisabel

Yeah, nobody with a lot of money made it without exploiting people


jojoju2000

On the backs of slaves.


notdorisday

Bingo!


ErikasCasita

Well there’s articles that point to Sutton’s family having obvious wealth since she was presented at a debutante ball. Whereas he ex husband, who she knew since 13, had a parent teaching at their school.


FundamentalBasic

Idk. Her dad was an architect and her mom was a social worker I think. They may have had a nice home, great vacations, nice cars and funded a private school education, dance classes at elite schools, etc but I don’t think they had the kind of money that adult Sutton has.


BrunoTheCat

Not for nothing, but doing the debutante circuit isn't really that big of a deal. I'm sure there are places like New York or Newport or St. Louis where it gets crazy expensive, but in a lot of places you kind of just sign up. It's not exactly cheap, but it's not out of the range of a lot of middle class families with 2 working professional parents.


jojoju2000

Thank you for providing some facts.


SouthGateTango

Just throwing it out there that my Prime Minister, Justin Trudeau (son of a former PM in case you don’t know CDN politics), taught my neighbour’s kids’ while he was a teacher before perusing politics. Just because someone teaches doesn’t = “poor”.


ErikasCasita

I didn’t say that they were poor. I just think Sutton’s family was more well off.


davidthomvs

Ok?


ErikasCasita

That’s the history of their wealth. Sutton’s family was well off before. They were in the upper tier of their society.


jojoju2000

I hope that doesn’t discount Garcelle’s own financial success. She’s self made.


ErikasCasita

It’s doesnt discount anyone’s wealth, but she would be classified as new money. It’s literally old inherited wealth vs newly earned wealth. If Garcelle came from a wealthy Haitian family with a long lineage of wealth over decades/centuries she’d be old money. There are lots of articles on this topic online.


jojoju2000

Dude. You’re obsessing too much over this social class thing. I did that. It was a bad mistake. They’re just rich okay ? They have access to things that working class people will never have.


ErikasCasita

I’m not obsessing over it. Go do some research.


jojoju2000

Go do some research on the history of old Southern Money.


davidthomvs

Who cares? They’re all rich attention seekers who went on reality tv. It’s so weird using if their great grandfather was rich or if they married rich as a judge of character which is (like it or not) how it’s used.


ErikasCasita

You may not care but there are people who do. I’m assuming you aren’t from inherited wealth and/or clout but if you were people would treat you differently. That’s the pure truth.


jojoju2000

The real rich won’t do reality tv. Or go out there and flaunt everything. They would rather go into public service. Go work in the Government or something like it. Reality TV is C/B List at best. No old money folk does it. The Kennedy’s would laugh. The Bushes. The Rockefeller’s. Winthrop’s. They have no freaking clue probably who Sutton is.


K-W152

Caroline Fleming has entered the chat.


whadunit

I was following until you said real rich would work in government/public service. They are not signing up to be a permit planner but probably on boards and commissions rigging the system so they stay wealthy. And setting up their own nonprofits for tax write offs


psy-ay-ay

Someone hasn’t seen ladies of london And Sutton is not some nobody lol. She’s on the board of trustees for the American ballet theater with Hamish Bowles. She’s invited to private dinners by Dior Couture. She’s one of only 100 individuals invited to be a friend of the costume institute for the metropolitan museum of art, literally sitting next to Gettys...


jojoju2000

Yeah because she has money now. I’m talking about the Old Money debate. We don’t know if Sutton has Old Money connection. And yet some people are acting like she does. And those shows have lost credibility for me after inviting a bunch of instagrammers to this year’s Vogue Magazine through the Met Gala.


ErikasCasita

The Hilton’s are actually old money and sparks was one of the first socialite to do a reality show. Tori Spelling?


jojoju2000

If you want to talk about Old Money; Let's talk about the Astors, The Livingstons, The Roosevelts, The DuPonts, The Byrds of Virginia. In terms of Europe : The Destroyed Royal Bloodlines of German's former duchies and monarchies. The Rothschilds too.


11Limepark

I was coming here to post this. It’s mostly true. I know old money is in all cultures but I think of it as a New England, East Coast thing. They are typically on the down low and the estates and land they have forever or sell,off slow. Most properties are inherited and many are at jobs in non profit sectors set up by trust. Most go to private schools and many graduate from schools that their families always went to. Good teeth, good skin and hair, good manners. Discreet trust funds. It’s a style and it’s sometimes expensive but it’s casual and practical, well made clothes and handy me down jewelry like good watches. They usually excel at a sport like tennis, golf, riding, skiing or boating. Typically bi lingual,well traveled from a young age. Modest. They can be a little cheap.


MGoBlue22

Yes I’m sure there are tons of people who won’t deal with new money. I’m sorry Mr. Bezos, your money is too new. We only accept old money here.


ErikasCasita

That has zero to do with the topic. No one is discounting the worth of money.


linzness

LOL ok.


winstonstigermum

I think so too, the difference between Tinsley and say Dorit for example


jojoju2000

The only other “ old money “ HW I can think on BH would be Adrienne Maloof.


jojoju2000

And they all have “ connections “. Hell even Tom and Erika despite them using those connections for bad things.


tracylacey

I just started Anderson Cooper's new book (Vanderbilt) today. You might enjoy it!


fuckyeahbravo

And of course the hot takes about new money vs old money all come from people who are neither (much like me)


vancity-chick

oh also all the comments snarking some HW’s for not having jobs and relying on their husbands… like do you know what show you’re watching?!?


kmc_1995

I always hated that. If a man (or woman if you believe Kandi was a sugar momma,) decides to take care of their significant other, so what? Taking care of kids, a home, etc contributes to the “bread winner’s” success.


jojoju2000

Being a Mom is the toughest job of all. ​ And yet moms never get paid.


[deleted]

Nor do we get time off or sick days 😂


starchildx

Can we please get past the hundred year propaganda that your job is your worth? The biggest load of bullshit humans ever bought into.


vancity-chick

So true, capitalism has brainwashed us all to think your career = your worth.


notdorisday

100%. Your value is what you bring to the world as a human operating in it. Your job might influence this sometimes - theres teachers who change lives, for example - but a high paying and “prestigious” job does not make you any better than anyone else. My dad was a publican and we struggled financially like woah and… he’s been gone almost 20 years and is still the standard for what I consider a good man to be!


MkupLady10

YES. And for how progressive Reddit, and this sub in particular, is supposed to be, it’s weird seeing so many comments snark when one of the wives accumulated more wealth due to their husband. But only for wives that are not as well liked (Crystal)- certain wives get cheered for it (Dorinda, Karen, even Yolanda)


starchildx

I loathe the Teen Mom sub where people actually wish for the cast to be fired so they have to work "a real job." They hate that they never "worked." 🤢 One of the most toxic things I've ever heard.


MkupLady10

Yikes. That’s pretty awful. :( it kind of seems like people feel that others need to struggle to get in a good place in life. So for those who are disliked (Crystal, Candiace, Mia), there are comments about how they either married into it, or inherited the wealth, and how they didn’t earn it, or if they did, it was by means that are frowned upon (Crystal being labeled a prostitute or groomed by her husband). And it’s weird, because life is already so hard- why would we fault others for having it easier? Would we not do the same if we had the chance? Especially because some wives are applauded for their life being more lofty, and the narrative is usually about how they did life “correctly” (Tinsley, Heather, Caroline). I guess I just don’t understand why the struggle is necessary for some of the women, but not others. Or why New vs Old Money is even an argument. Like does it really matter, as long as the money is legitimate? (As in not fraudulent, a la Erika or Jen). Sorry, such a long comment in response to yours! Please disregard my rambling


jojoju2000

What's funny is that when Crystal was announced last year; people say they liked her because she had her own " company ". They seem to conveniently forget that as they maul her to death this season.


VaguelyArtistic

I know the company exists. Has she ever talked about how she’s involved? Anything about it? I feel like, two episodes in, Jennie has talked more about the business she *doesn’t* own anymore than Crystal Hs raped about the company she does own.


jojoju2000

Crystal claims that Bravo cut a lot of her scenes out because of the intense focus on Erika’s issues.


starchildx

100% let’s try to make life easier and nicer.


jojoju2000

Heather Dubrow didn't seem to have a job on OC and yet she never was criticized. But when Crystal pops up and says something stupid ( I admit )...


RandomAngeleno

> Heather Dubrow didn't seem to have a job on OC and yet she never was criticized. What are you *talking about*???? Her "Malibu Country" gig was a whole storyline, complete with Gretchen's wannabe bullshit. 😂 As an actress, one could even argue that she had a job just by being on the show, and she certainly ***worked*** and ***delivered*** with the iconic Bow-gate finale.


advocatecarey

Heather was a successful actress before and during her marriage. She was rather well known in the 90’s and early 2000’s, staring in many tv series.


davidthomvs

She was a side character on a popular tv show for one year. She’d like you to believe so but she was not Jennifer Anniston.


[deleted]

Heather Dubrow is as close to Jennifer Aniston as Alexis Bellino is to Katie Keurig


VaguelyArtistic

“Today, in coffee news….”


advocatecarey

That’s entirely not true. Here is her IMDB [Heather Paige Kent ](https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0656686/) She was a main character on “That’s Life”, “Stark Raving Mad” and “Jenny”. I’m old and actually watched her in real time…well before RHOC.


anniebananie217

Hardcore agree. They have way more $$$ than I will ever have! It’s like when I sit on the couch eating cookies while watching the olympics and criticize the athletes for a ‘mistake’ lol. I can say some of them have better behavior than others but they’re all rich housewives lol.


jojoju2000

I guess my peeve comes from the fact; I actually have a old money family history. My family came from Vietnam and before the Vietnam War ended in 1975, the whole tree was well.... Upper Class. Landowners, Tea Barons. Military Officers, Teachers ( It was very upper class to be a Teacher in Vietnam ). And yet it all ended after 1975. The New Government destroyed everything. So to me; the old money stuff doesn't matter anymore to me. It's just money.


notdorisday

Yes! It’s such an asinine and elitist concept and it completely shadows the really problem with wealth which is it’s distributed so disproportionately within our society and our world.


vancity-chick

yes its like who cares. its weird when they try to make it seem like coming from old money is superior and better than new money, just so icky!! no one can control what family they were born into.


yunith

New money means you worked for your money. Old money sits on their butt, judges others for working, and then gatekeeps their precious class system.


ErikasCasita

That’s just the world. The Kennedy’s are not on the same level Girardi. Old money helped build the US. There’s are museums, arts centers, college wings, libraries that hold those names. Not giving that recognition is kinda weird.


jojoju2000

And The Kennedy’s would be the first ones to say you’re crazy. What Old Money person would go into a Reality TV Show right ? They would enter public service, Do something better for their countrymen. Not this sh!t.


vancity-chick

Exactly like there are so many rich people no one knows about. Those people are NOT gunna go on the real housewives. I honestly don’t care about old money rich people, it just means they got their money thru exploitation and continue to pass on the wealth to their children so they can do nothing and look down on poor people.


jojoju2000

On the flip side, Ted Kennedy fought for Universal Healthcare and a fairer higher minimum wage. FDR was well….. he created social security.


-Odi-Et-Amo-

He also murdered a woman.


SouthGateTango

It might be wrong but this comment plus your flair made me lol


overflowingsandwich

Funny to even think old money people are doing anything good for their countrymen lol. Most of them are donating to charity for tax write offs then lobbying governments to screw other people over in order to keep themselves rich.


justlainey

Kennedy’s aren’t old money. That’s what’s funny in the US. Kennedy’s are bootleg money made good through politics and marrying into old money like Jackie. Same old story writ large. Many English families literally had to have American heiresses marry into a title to hang onto their ancestral piles.


ivegotanewwaytowalk

kennedy fortune was built on bootlegging and probably other illegal activities of the era lol joe kennedy sr. was a shark


myskepticalbrowarch

... I thought Crystal and Sutton were both new money. I get the Crystal's father may have been a doctor (I could be getting that wrong) and Sutton seems like she came from upper middle class but both woman were not 1%ers until adulthood. (Same with Rob and Christopher). Even the Trumps are still considered new money. Old money is like Koch or Rockefeller.


kg703

sutton did say she and her husband made all their money from "nothing" I think her parents weren't poor but they weren't super rich. most southern women do debutant and other social activities to keep up with the joneses.


myskepticalbrowarch

It is a weird American thing to make it seem like you came from nothing... But I am under the impression her parents were very least middle class.


jojoju2000

Rob Minkoff's father seems to be High end in the Palo Alto History books.


myskepticalbrowarch

Still the Minkoff's aren't by any means an American family dynasty (yet, Crystal seems to have the grit to set the direction) For reference even the Kennedy's aren't considered old money. It is the Elitist title of all Elitist titles. Honestly I can really only recall Koch, Rockefeller, Murdoch and Berrymore (Drew Berry is part of this dynasty). The oldest money on Bravo is probably Shep Rose from Southern Charm... And it is a good example why old money is a hard status to obtain since he got a prestigious MBA to surf and own a Dive bar. Next would probably be Josh Flagg from MDLLA.


jayemadd

Josh Flagg is absolutely new money, but the difference is his grandmother was a badass genius and built an empire for all her descendants.


myskepticalbrowarch

Honestly, I am mad at my self for under estimating Edith. The woman was out of this world.


jojoju2000

Don’t forget about the Roosevelts and the Massachusetts families.


cprunkl

Are there any truly old money HWs? That means ones who came from the family, not just married into it?


Just_Tomorrow_8561

Oh how could we forget The Morgans and The Count!


jojoju2000

Tinsley. And Adrienne Malooof.


Just_Tomorrow_8561

Southern Charm cast has old money. I think the Westcotts are old money as well.


Fowatza

The Westcotts are not. Court’s dad initially made his money with car dealerships (and sounds like in a shady manner) and parlayed it from there.


Just_Tomorrow_8561

I stand corrected! For some reason I thought his family was a big deal


Disastrous_Author638

Your post history shows you contributed a LOT to the old money vs new money dialogue.


dupedairies

I really hate positive connotation of "Old Money". Old money = exploitation of the poor prior to labor laws to me


davidthomvs

Especially when talking about people who all joined a reality tv show anyway.


jojoju2000

Exactly. Real Old Money folks would never do reality tv.


Senior_Ice8748

For real. It's such a dumb classist argument especially when there are so few wealthy, established, storied families outside of major coastal cities in the US. I'd also like a clear distinction of what separates the upper middle class from the rich.


Tea-cher_preacher

I hear you but sometimes there’s different implications depending on the context. Like when you watch Southern Charm and Whitney and Thomas boast about being old money they are basically boasting about coming from a lineage of slave owners.


BrunoTheCat

A couple things. All 'new money' eventually becomes 'old money'. New money/old money absolutely developed as a pejorative othering of an upstart immigrant industrial-merchant class of newly rich people. What we think of now as "old money" (Vanderbilt, Astor, Rockefeller, Morgan, Carnegie) were 100% flashy new money outcasts in 1890. They had enough capital to buy themselves fancy houses and summer in Newport but their sons still worked in the family office and their daughters still made the papers. That means they engaged in labor (ewww) and publicity (even grosser). Plus, 'new money' tends to have more ACTUAL MONEY than 'old money'. Old Money has longevity, connections, respectability - things that ACTUAL MONEY can't buy because they don't always have much of it so they draw a bright line between acquisition of status and inheritance of status. As for who would do reality tv - they'd all fucking do it. We don't live in 1900 anymore where publicity was almost always seen as a negative. The attention and information economy is powerful. Real European 'old money' has to pay for the upkeep of their gigantic, drafty ass estates somehow. 100 years ago they married the rich daughters of American industrialists, now they rent out their houses for Downton Abbey tours. Also, the range of personalities who are born into that level of wealth aren't a monolith. For every person who wouldn't dream of courting the publicity, you have people who are BORED and want to do something different.


maeby_surely_funke

I think the difference between “old money” and “new money” is how people carry themselves. I grew up hearing the phrase “money talks” but “wealth whispers.” I also grew up with no money in a community surrounded by people with “old money.” I have friends that have never worked a day in their lives that receive $40k per month from a trust set up for them by a grandparent or great grandparent. They were raised with all of the social graces that my family did not have time to teach me. This is the reason I find a distinction: Even if they are truly not “super mega rich” they have been raised by parents (generation after generation) with complete financial security; and therefore tend to have a different outlook on life and approach to life. There is no amount of “new money“ in the world that can change our childhoods (and that of our entire family for generations).


tergesa

They're not all rich though and there's a monumental difference between old and new money


jojoju2000

Elon Musk has more economic influence, political power than any Carnegie today. And yet he’s new money.


tergesa

K


tracylacey

It's interesting that this topic came up today. I just started reading Anderson Cooper's new book and learned that the Vanderbilts were considered new money. That surprised me! I haven't seen these discussions you're referring to but am thinking it's more rich vs ultra rich than new vs old money. The idea being that ultra rich is much more frugal and less flashy than the "just rich" who tend to buy the biggest house, flashiest cars, and obvious clothing labels.


schmoopie76

Just started listening (I do Audible) it’s so good! The wealth in that book is jaw dropping


tracylacey

If I'm being open and honest like Kyle Richards, I'm listening on Audible, too! 😄


K-W152

Says OP who makes a post talking about old money vs new money 😂


Smart-Ad-9992

Why is new money getting slack, when these people are actually the ones who worked hard for what they have?


Just_Tomorrow_8561

There is a huge difference between old money and new money. The area I live has old money in the suburbs and new money in the city. New money is flashy and is top line of everything but can quickly go bankrupt in an instant. Old money invest that money to grow over time. You usually only see the tip of the ice berg with them. Their name usually carries a good amount of weight to it and have serious connections. THINK Dorit vs Tinsley. Majority of the housewives are new money. Southern charm has old money. Tinsley is old money.


kg703

In terms of house wives they are all flashy, not sure who has old money really. Old money never talks like they do. I married into a very old money family and they would never buy stuff like that, they shop at Walmart. They do have nice things and take nice trips but don’t stay in the presidential suite it’s more sensible and practical. The reason they have old money is they conserve it, new money is more prone to blow it.


TomatilloNo6076

there is a difference tho... so no. ps these shows are shameless and ridiculous and so is old money vs new money. deal with it!


Interesting-Wasabi-6

Is anyone on Bravo old money? Apart from Tinsley maybe...?


lunariacarrier

As someone who lives in LA, I would say old money vs new money are huge cultural differences here. It impacts the city heavily and certainly these social groups.


Maleficent-Equal9337

Regardless of what you think, the distinction is important, even if it rubs you the wrong way. We may be poor compared to them, but in their circles New versus Old Money is a VERY big deal. It also means a VERY different lifestyle than any of these women can even show us, not only in terms of money but also experience and refinement. I would much prefer old money manners and cosmopolitanism like Sutton than the new money garishness of people like Tamra Judge and Vicki Gunvalson, and this seems to be a sentiment others on the thread share as well.


jojoju2000

Right…. And when you come to a new country, none of that matters. Believe me. My family has been through it all.


Maleficent-Equal9337

I am an actual immigrant, so please don’t tell me what does and doesn’t matter when you immigrate to another country. I can tell you for SURE that my parents’ relationships from our countries of origin still stand and hold strong, including understanding of wealth and refinement. My parents ties and social cache has translated into the US because there are diasporic members of our origin countries here, so we absolutely know family reputations from back in the “home country” and rely on them even today when interacting with members of our ethnic communities. Also, you are aware that there are a NUMBER of American old money families right? The Carnegies, Vanderbilts, Rockefellers, Morgans to name a few. These were all old money families whose wealth was BORN in the USA. No immigration involved at all. Not quite sure why you’re involving immigration here.


jojoju2000

My grandpa literally thinks Blacks are unclean and that He wants a return to Monarchy and Vietnamese Catholic Nationalism. And French Culture. I just don’t see it. My grandparents still do. He’s that type of Old Money. He gets giddy when my cousins got accepted to Brown and Stanford.


Maleficent-Equal9337

Okay….? None of what you just said speaks to your original post or anything that I have written. Don’t really know how to respond to your racist grandpa and your ivy accepted family members, or what that has to do with new versus old money discussions of US wealth and dynastic families . . .


jojoju2000

My point is; My Grandparents see that Ivy League education as a way back to Prestige and Honor. Whatever that might be. Me personally I don’t care. You can lose any type of Money. And you have to move, and start all over again and you’re just a number. A refugee. In America, we’re not at that point where you lose everything quite yet, but all these rich people in America have had it quite good.


Maleficent-Equal9337

Again, what you are saying now has no bearing on your original post which can be summed up as follows: "they're all rich so who fucking cares how rich!" Your responses to my comments now mention racism, getting back former prestige, losing money, being a number in America . . . I can't keep up and none of it has anything to do with what I said. Lololol! Long story short, if you want to look at all "rich people" as just "rich people" that's good for you, but there ARE distinctions between Rinna and a Rockefeller, and those distinctions are pretty fucking MEANINGFUL. The most blatant example of this would be involvement and attendance of royal events across the globe. You sure as hell aren't gonna see Rinna or Ramona being invited to a soiree held by Princess Charlene of Monaco.


jojoju2000

Lisa Rinna however has connections to her section of wealth. Heck even Tom and Erika even though they used those connections for nefarious reasons ( Kamala Harris, Gavin Newsom… ). And my original post was intended for Sutton because people were assuming that she had a family history of old money or something. You’re not going to see ANY HW attend a Royal event. People have been putting Sutton up on a pedastal like she is a Rockefeller.


Maleficent-Equal9337

Lolololol! You're right, you're absolutely not going to see a housewife attend a royal event, or the met gala for that matter, but that doesn't mean there aren't housewives that run in circles of elite wealth affiliated with "old money" that attend such events or are adjacent to such events. The closest we've been to old money on RHOBH is certainly this season, with both Sutton and Kathy Hilton. And their behavior is clearly very distinct from some of the other women on the show now (or before) such as Dorito and Brandi Glanville, who are always looking for their tawdry moments. It's a WHOLE different vibe, and that's for a REASON. The viewers are entitled to discuss the facts and the connections. If any other Housewife can drip in Cartier, take me to D&G's penthouse, serve me a Baccarat dinner **(all WITHOUT defrauding orphans and widows)** then I am HERE for it. But none have done so before Ms. Sutton or Kathy (and it's clearly not because they're over here struggling to make their coins).


pierrrecherrry

real and pretend, that’s the real dichotomy


TheMostRandomWordz

Spoken like new money lol


UrbanPlannerholic

By comparison for MDLA would we say Josh Flagg is old money?


uhcrapsomething

Oh my god theres a sub for this trash? You guys are sad...


Dry-Razzmatazz8352

I really only cared about the new vs old money conversation when everyone ganged up on Tinsley in RHONY. They could just not understand how Tinsley can afford the lifestyle she had without a “sugar daddy” and were super mean to her and spread rumours . The reality is that Tinsley is old money, even if she doesn’t work a day in her life she has money, and all the other ladies married into it or worked for it themselves. They never had the lifestyle Tinsley had without someones help ( except Bethanny) and that’s why they attacked Tinsley. I also think the reason Dorinda hated Tinsley so much was that she has lost her place in high society when her husband died, and quiet frankly even than she was never on the level Tinsley was. She saw Tinsley do great without a husband, and she was jealous. They also constantly talked about money which made Tinsley uncomfortable because she was raised in an actual rich family where talking about money was considered rude. I think this whole argument showed some of the differences between old and new money.