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Is there a guide for a hotswappable Bluetooth dactyl manuform with a trackball?

Is there a guide for a hotswappable Bluetooth dactyl manuform with a trackball?

imposter_oak

The Charybdis or Charybdis Nano from [bastardkb](https://bastardkb.com/) is one that looks promising to me. Not sure if it's been released or when he's planning on releasing it. But for bluetooth, I don't know if ZMK has trackball support in the pipeline so that may be a bit of an issue if you wanted to plug a nice!nano into any dactyl with a trackball.


RevanchistVakarian

Charybdis Nano is definitely going to be my next board whenever it's released, but it should be noted that (last I checked) /u/fmcraft's flex PCBs are not hot swap compatible; they're fixed to the switches with solder, rather than being fixed to the case with plastic tabs or something like that.


Fmcraft

Hey ! Thanks for the interest. I'm working through the first wave of orders, but there's a lot of demand. I'm also working on some PCBs and processes to make production on my side faster and larger-scale. If you're going to DIY it, all the files are on GitHub Cheers


imposter_oak

out of curiosity, what are you gonna use to fix the boards to the chair arms? i use a wireless corne and would love to attempt something similar


guywolf10

Might drill into the arm rests and attach with screws from the underside, but will probably design and print an adapter of some sorts to attach to the front of the arm rests. I might even make new arm rests altogether with a space for it


imposter_oak

One of my friends was talking about attempting something similar and sent me this a while back. Could be a good starting point or useful as inspiration! https://www.monstertechusa.com/product/joystick-hotas-chair-mount/


guywolf10

Thanks!


w0lfwood

[these can clamp on](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00BT7EA18?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share) to your chair arms and then you can attach a [VESA plate](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07MJTJ6T4?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share) to the mount. I have an openscad widget that i applied to the bottom plate of my DM and ploopy trackball to mount a cup magnet inside them so they stay put when i tent/tilt the VESA plate.


Mimifan2

Do you know if either of those are on GitHub? I like the look of the standard version, but I don't think that's a standard generated dactyl.


Mimifan2

https://github.com/Bastardkb/charybdis Answered my own question nvm.


imposter_oak

Yeah, not sure if they're standard true dactyls but it's the closest I could fine for a near-production version with a trackball without having to go full-on DIY.


Mimifan2

Yeah, I've looked at it and I'm kinda sold now. It's completely open source so going to try a DIY version. Should be ~~fun~~ hard. Lol


Fmcraft

Hey, thanks for the interest :) I've worked a lot on the hardware and had some help on the firmware (in a PR right now... For sniping, dragscroll, all the good stuff). I've also revised the build guides so if you're handy with a 3d printer and ordering stuff online, should be okay. Still very hard, but definetly easier than starting from scratch. The most challenging in the build will be handwiring, and the sensor PCB which has some very small components (SOT-25). You could also use a tindie controller....


Mimifan2

Awesome! I actually joined the discord yesterday to ask some questions about it. Sounds awesome. I do have a 3d printer handy, however was worried about sourcing the sensor (wasn't sure if the tindie one would work) and the elite c adapter(not entirely sure what that does). Would a 3D printed mount be an okay replacement for that? I can't find it at the moment OFC but I have one somewhere I will reply with that has a spot for the c and the jack. I also didn't realize there was a build guide, was going based solely off of the GitHub readme, so will have to review that in more detail. Thanks! Edit: This is the link to the file I was referring to, unfortunately I can only find a download link. https://dactyl.siskam.link/loligagger-external-holder-elite-c-v1.stl


Fmcraft

Hey, You can use a 3d printed mount yes, found here: https://github.com/geoffder/dometyl-keyboard/blob/main/things/holders/bastardkb/printable_shield.stl I recommend ordering the pcbs if you can though, it's much nicer to use


Mimifan2

Okay thanks!


tenstaana

Bluetooth's gonna be easy. Just swap your controller for a bluetoothi capable one like a nice!nano. For the intregrated trackball... yo'ud probably need to cannibalize a wireless trackball and build it into your dactyl.


Mimifan2

I'm looking for something similar. Not so interested in Bluetooth. My learnings so far are... Hot swap shouldn't really be a priority, it's nice to have, but also generally leads to less stable switches. There are a lot of dactyl trackballs out there, I can make a list later if your interested, but they all are very different and it's going to take some time to figure out which will work for you. Also trackballs with one sensor can't do scrolling on the same ball without a new layer. There is a trackball that has 2 or 3 that can do that, which is something I'd want. But haven't seen a dactyl that has it.


guywolf10

I'd appreciate a list, thanks! I agree with you about the hotswappability, it's not a priority and I could get around it by just researching more about different switches and choosing the right ones


Mimifan2

* [Track Beast](https://medium.com/@kincade/track-beast-build-log-a-trackball-dactyl-manuform-19eaa0880222) * [rTrack](https://gitlab.com/keyboards1/dm_r_track) * [Charybdis](https://github.com/Bastardkb/Charybdis) * [Oddball](https://atulloh.github.io/oddball/) * [Tractyl Manuform](https://github.com/noahprince22/tractyl-manuform-keyboard) * [ErgoWarp](https://github.com/pseudoku/ErgoWarp) * [Yowkees](http://xahlee.info/kbd/yowkees_keyboard.html) * [Keyball46](https://github.com/Yowkees/keyball/blob/main/keyball46/doc/rev1/buildguide_jp.md) * [Dactyl-Stein](https://www.reddit.com/r/ErgoMechKeyboards/comments/l3nvp0/my_dactylstein_is_complete_alongside_the_outside/) * [Arcade](https://github.com/sbabborello/qmk_firmware/tree/master/keyboards/SplitArcade) Note: None of these are my projects, this post is purely for reference for others interested in a Dactyl board with a trackball integrated into it. I cannot help with any build, and have no experience with any of these keyboards.


guywolf10

Thanks!


Mimifan2

Cool will work on one later. From what I understand it seems like most people work dactyls change them enough that if you decide you want a different switch you probably also want a different layout lol. So be careful with the rabbit hole your about to go down lol.


Finn1sher

> trackballs with one sensor can't do scrolling on the same ball without a new layer Of course, you have to change layers to change functionality - but multiple sensors would change that? Please explain :)


Mimifan2

Yeah I didn't know how layers work with trackballs, but there is at least one trackball project that can sense movement in 3 axis letting you twist the ball and scroll without changing layers. > Kensington Slimblade (probably my second favorite, although not for its ergonomics): twisting the ball in the Z axis acts like a scroll-wheel > To be able to sense rotation in all three axes, it needs to use two mouse sensors, positioned at different points around the ball. https://github.com/monroewilliams/trackball


Finn1sher

Ah, twisting. Imagine 4 sensors on the Douballz - you could say that'd be baller


tenstaana

https://imgur.com/gallery/h6kFG18 point and scroll


tenstaana

For the Douballz I used 1 PMW330 sensor on each side. On handles scrolling, the other pointing. You could actually change the behavior of the trackball based on a keypress or layer change. Ill post video in a bit


Finn1sher

Yeah I doubt 6 axes of trackball on one layer would be necessary, but awesome build nonetheless


Finn1sher

A trackball dactyl is probably the most stationary keyboard we've got - the obsession with wireless has gone a bit far when people want that to be Bluetooth 🤔 Ignoring the down votes, here's my reasoning: Wireless is a tradeoff. You have to charge it, there can be increased latency, it's complicated to build, and it's another short lifespan lithium ion battery shoved into a product that doesn't need it.