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This Election Race Is (Probably) Going to Be Seattle’s Tightest

This Election Race Is (Probably) Going to Be Seattle’s Tightest

JMace

It's ridiculous that this is so close. Just look at a couple of Nikkita's positions. Nikkita is asking for complete abolishment of the police department without a proven plan to replace the services that they do provide. Yes we need to reform the police, but we absolutely cannot operate without police or without a *proven* plan that would handle those services. We need someone to answer 911 calls. We need police to respond to domestic violence issues, or to respond when there's a drunk driver on the road. She was also looking to create a new fund inside the city parks department “to support people who use the parks for housing, enabling parks to help sustainably and humanely address the needs of unsheltered people”. No, the parks are not campgrounds. They are for everyone to use, not for whoever decides to pop up a tent. That is not a plan, that is avoiding the problem. I want to be able to use the parks by my house, I want my wife and kid to feel like they can go to the playground without worrying if they'll be accosted by someone mentally unstable or on drugs.


DFWalrus

>Nikkita is asking for complete abolishment of the police department without a proven plan to replace the services that they do provide. That's false. They've pointed to a National Institute for Criminal Justice Reform study that showed that approximately 50% of the calls that the police handle do not need a police response. They've called for partially defunding the police in order to fund other services that can handle these calls. Programs that can do this, like Triage One, are already being piloted by the city. The city needs to build trust with people who have been forced to live outside. The city has spent the past few years sweeping them, dehumanizing them, and destroying their stuff. If we want people to trust and accept help from the city, we have to proactively begin helping them where they are first.


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DFWalrus

Ah yes, you've pulled a quote from the Sara Nelson mailer. That tweet was a response to SPD arresting people for drawing on the sidewalk with chalk. The long term goal for a person like Oliver is *creating a society that doesn't need the police*, so that makes sense. The short term goal - the one that they're directly campaigning on, which I do agree with - is cutting SPD's funding and redirecting it toward other sorts of first response programs, so those programs can handle the 50% of calls that do not require a police presence. That will also allow SPD to focus on violent crime. It's actually what police all over the country were asking for until they realized it'd come out of their budget.


williehoward

It. All. Requires. A. Plan. Not "shoot first, and whatever you hit, call that your target!"


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BadUX

China, while still better than the US for %, still has an insanely large illegal drug issue. Also you can't get great free education in China, the high schools you have to pay for - and test to get in. If you don't test well, you won't get into a good high school. Actually you have to test into middle school, so it's increasingly becoming a place for mostly just rich people. I'm not making any statements about the US being on better footing here, but your idea of what happens in China seems to be rooted in fantasy, not reality.


BadUX

(K-8 is free in China, 9-12 is not free. College is obviously not free either)


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BadUX

It's a weird system, both public and private. The basics are extremely cheap, but if you have anything tricky then you're often left having to pay for it on your own (or most of it) It was getting a lot less public for years and years, I believe it's still trending in that direction. Insulin is still dirt cheap at least, which is good for my diabetic family over there. So that's nice


DFWalrus

It just so happens to be a Nelson talking point and on her fliers - [https://twitter.com/BD4Nikkita/status/1452309823400333317](https://twitter.com/BD4Nikkita/status/1452309823400333317) Like I said, I agree with the short term goal and that's why I'm voting for Oliver. I've never agreed 100% with the candidates I vote for, but I very much agree with defunding by 50% and refunding social services. Other countries have had far more success with decriminalizing drug usage. We should continue down that path and continue investing in addiction treatment as a health issue, rather than treating it with jail. >Which is again why I don't like local progressive politics, I wish some of these things were on the books federally. This isn't how the US system of government is set up. The Federal level is designed to block change. The $15 minimum wage is a good example of how policy spreads across the US. First Seattle, then other west coast cities, then states like California and New York. Stopping something locally is how you kill it before it can take off.


williehoward

Piloted?


Bulky_Claim

How would one go about proving a plan other than implementing the plan?


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DFWalrus

Like [this study](https://www.reddit.com/r/Seattle/comments/ovc0nd/669_of_spds_time_is_spent_responding_to/)? Or [this program](https://www.seattle.gov/fire/safety-and-community/mobile-integrated-health/health-one#whatisthehealthoneprogram)?


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DFWalrus

>stop scaring grandma with "defund" That's what you're doing. Stop doing it and we can make some progress. Deal? >The fact any high tension situation in the USA could turn into a shooting match because of guns fundamentally changes things though... The old, "I'd love to, but..." There will always be a reason that things can never change. >Police union. Suggestions? They are a major blocker here. The cops voted for Mike Solan to lead their union, so the rot doesn't originate in the union, but rather in the cops themselves. We should do what it takes to fire all of SPD and re-hire on a case-by-case basis with the stipulation that they all must live in Seattle. Not expecting that to be a perfect fix, but it'd be a step in the right direction.


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DFWalrus

You know how politics works. Oliver getting elected will not give them the power to singlehandedly defund SPD by 100%. There will be a compromise, which will look more measured and slower than most expect. I'm sure Lisa Herbold will find ways to throw wrenches into the gears, as she always does. I haven't followed Georgia's police situation, but I will take a look. And yeah, there are probably too many guns everywhere, but I'm more concerned with inequality, which has a strong correlation to gun violence. Plenty of countries have high gun ownership levels without the same sorts of mass shootings and general gun violence. I guarantee you that some liberals and leftists bought guns thinking that they might need to protect themselves from the police if shit ever gets really wild.


Bulky_Claim

Ok, but we already did that.


JMace

By showing examples of where it worked before. If her plans are so completely radical that they have not been implemented in any city in the US to date, then we sure as hell don't need to be the guinea pig. We are not in a stable position as it is, and testing some new theory about completely removing police is exactly what we *don't* need.


Bulky_Claim

How did the first place where it worked before prove it?


JMace

They didn't. They experimented with new ideas. Some ideas worked, many more experiments failed. That's the nature of testing new ideas. However, we are a major city. You don't use major cities as test subjects for unfounded ideas. It's better to test on neighborhoods, or small cities and towns, learn from what works and what doesn't and then scale up as required. The downside is far less drastic. Does that make sense?


Bulky_Claim

No, why would you expect a neighborhood or minor city to be representative of major cities?


Sk3eBum

Repeat after me: Abolition is a losing platform. Maybe Nikkita can get elected next time when they advocate for policies people actually support.


purpleerfitz

It's worse than that, if things head any closer that direction ... we're all going to be fucked when a Trump 2.0 is elected along with a flipped house and senate because regular people are over the fuckery that comes with abolition. Suzie doesn't give a shit about reform when her kids are being chased by the local crack addict for the 3rd time in a week and 911 calls go directly to a full vm box cause the people in charge are twiddling their fingers reimagining basic services. This is how abhorrent shit like the tx abortion gets through. Everyone is distracted by the stupid loud crowd who's plans aren't realistic (or even make sense) and for normal people when push comes to shove want safety for their family.


AgentElman

The defense of NTK at this point feels like the defense of Trump. Show quotes of what they say and the defense is "they were joking". Respected members of their party say they should not be supported and those people are traitors to the party. The attacks on Ann are that she is a Republican. No substantial attacks on her positions. Just demonizing her for belonging to the other party.


Bulky_Claim

Traditionally, when someone chooses to identify as a member of a political party, they are giving you information about their positions.


Display_Comfortable

Thank you for sharing your take on a different race.


Murbela

To be fair, it is a big deal for people in Seattle to vote for a republican. It would be equivalent to people in (rural) Texas voting democrat. It is going to be much more palatable for many to just not vote for either.


DFWalrus

>Engendering everything from progressive plaudits to comment section profanities **to sentences beginning “I’m a progressive, but—” (Seattle may lead in this category)**, the legislative body has become something of a third-rail for polite conversationalists. Someone's been on this subreddit.


wastingvaluelesstime

oh I hear this in real life too


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Display_Comfortable

I think you're the one that might need to read it again.


OnlineMemeArmy

I think you're missing the point.


japangrrl451

A lot of people miss your point. You're a very misunderstood character.


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japangrrl451

lol


ItsUrPalAl

This one probably wouldn't be as close if Ann and NTK weren't stealing the spotlight


OnlineMemeArmy

Yeah, this position only has one extremist running as opposed to two.


Dances-With-Taco

In Seattle, a moderate is an extremist!


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japangrrl451

Sure, Jan.