We managed to toilet train cows, and they learned faster than a toddler

We managed to toilet train cows, and they learned faster than a toddler


1. Cattle can learn to attend to their own urination reflex, because they moved to the pen when ready to use it. 2.Cattle will learn to withhold urination until they’re in the right place, if they’re rewarded for doing so.


Paper trained, at best. Shame, I was really hoping to see a picture of a cow sitting on a big-ass toilet


I too came for the giant toilet and am disappointed.


I mean, if you just install one one of those showers without a side wall into the barn and presto, cow toilet


Hi, Billy Mays here with the Cow Patty Potty.


but who's gonna wanna waffle stomp that much?


Maybe this is just because a big-ass toilet wasn't provided


I like that you can hyphenate the phrase "big ass toilet" either way and it still works: Big-ass toilet/big ass-toilet


This might actually be a bit of a game changer. Cows not having to wade through their own feces all the time should lessen hoof infections and the use of antibiotics.


I'm amazed that anyone is surprised here. Cows are super, super smart. Far more intelligent and emotionally complex than dogs at least.


Most animals display quite a bit of intelligence and emotional complexity. People tend to not see it in animals they view as food though. It tends to fuck with ones psyche when you begin to empathize with your food.


You're absolutely right.


There's nothing wrong with eating meat, but there might be something wrong with the ignorance about where it comes from


It's not that it's right or wrong.. it's that you have a choice in what you perceive to be right and wrong.. and whether you want to act in a way that reduces wrongs and increases rights. If you think there is a valid argument about the meat industry, but don't like the idea of not eating meat, then there's nothing wrong with reducing your weekly meat intake by one day a week. It doesn't have to be 'all meat' or 'no meat'.


It takes more than reducing your own intake, there needs to be greater awareness to promote better care for farmed animals.


I didn't say there was something wrong with it. I said it's a defense mechanism because if people view themselves as eating lesser species that aren't capable of contemplating some sort of quality of life or emotions, or anything else, it's easier to justify it. That also makes it a lot easier to accept practices like factory farming, because it abstracts away the suffering those animals go through. Me? I like meat, I'll eat it, but I do understand where it comes from. I do find I'm a happier person overall though when I don't think about what sort of life the steak I ate for dinner could have had instead though.


>what sort of life the steak I ate for dinner could have had instead though. I raised cattle. It wouldn't have had a life at all. The entire species is built on the assumption of human exploitation. Without it and its subsidies (if you like), they'd not last that long in the true wild. California's mountain lions, bears, wolves, coyotes, etc. would predate them pretty heavily. They aren't adapted for the Real World (Cape Buffalo, OTOH, are).


House cats, dogs, and rabbits don’t last long in the wild either. They still get pretty good lives when humans care for them.


My uncle bought a cow back in the 80s. It was tied on a long leash in front of his house. It would play with us kids out there. When my dad and I would drive up, it would get real happy and come over to us and lick my face. When my uncle eventually killed it later that year, my cousins and I freaked out. My aunt even cried about it. He never bought another cow ever again. While I do still eat meat, I've never looked at cows the same since he had that one.


Imo it's really important to keep pet animals and farm animals separate. Once the cow licks your face and plays with your children, it is not an eating cow anymore.


> Once the cow licks your face and plays with your children, it is not an eating cow anymore. At my house the line was once they got a name. It's much harder to eat something that had a name.


It's unusual - naming food. Today I had a tuna sandwich named Kevin.


The pet calf gets to go live with another family. At least once, it was really true, because I saw her several years later.


My grandmother grew up on a farm in the kentuckiana area and learned to do this. Even with domestic dogs and cats she was a limited with her affection.


my grandma got in trouble because when she found out her dad was intending to butcher the turkeys, she opened their pen and shooed them all out, telling them to run away.


Silence of the Turkeys


never was.


Yea, my mom isn't the most emotionally available person in the world and I often wonder it goes back to her time on the farm. She once hand raised a calf, taught it tricks, basically everything - and then... her family had it killed and spent the next year telling her to go to the basement to get a package of "Brownie" out of the deep freeze.


I was out at a farm west of town to finish up an insurance claim over a burned barn. I noticed a 3 legged pig running around the farm yard. It seemed to get around quite well using a prosthetic leg. I asked the farmer what happened to his pig?. "Let me tell you about homer, that is a special pig" he drawled. "That pig saved my life last summer" he continued. "When I got caught up under my tractor, when it rolled over on top of me, that pig ran to the farmhouse got the Mrs to get me pulled out, that is one special pig" I looked at the pig somewhat skeptically, "Okay but why does homer have just three legs"? The farmer apparently was just getting started. "Homer here is the reason that the barnfire didn't didnt get completely ruin my business" he went on. "If it hadn't been for him, I wouldn't have been able to get the livestock out, or been able to get the fire knocked down enough for the volunteers to get here and save the strucure" He glanced over at Homer, the pig was sitting in the shade looking quite content. Now to tell the truth I was getting pretty impressed by this pig, impressed enough that I planned on including the tale in my final report. To get the entire story I again asked what happened to the pigs leg. The farmer looked at me and said "Well if you have a pig as special as Homer, you don't want to eat it all at once".


Why eat meat after that? You've already understood that farm animals aren't robots. Dropping meat or drastically reducing consumption isn't at all difficult.


Because we're not insufferable douchebags who deny almost all of human history's hunting/gathering & eating patterns and instead try to substitute saving animals for the trauma they suffered as children. That's why. I don't care what happened to you. Rabbits taste good. Veal is rad. Humane meat is wonderful. I raised beef cattle and gave them the best life I could, but at the end of they day they ended up porterhouses and shanks. That's why they existed.


Skimming this comment I thought I saw "human meat is wonderful" and was very concerned for a moment


Ugh, this either/or dichotomy. We can have pork belly AND my special surprise meat. It's so much better when there's a surprise, like a navel ring.


We had 2 pigs once. So cute in the spring but they got scary by the fall and it was good to see them turned into pork chops and bacon


>While I do still eat meat, I've never looked at cows the same since he had that one. This is your brain on cognitive dissonance. But really... Not even trying to to preach, but I cannot imagine eating an animal that's smart enough to greive when it's best buddy is slaughtered, or a depressed momma cow that's been raped then had her children stolen and killed repeatedly, and has the mental capacity to understand what's happening, especially without understanding why. Life is a horror movie for a cow.


I get that perspective, but nature is a horror movie for most animals. Granted modern factory farming like you are partially describing is a special kind of hell and we should be actively working to regulate and fix it. However i just cant make the leap from there to not eating meat at all. Predation is a natural part of life, and cows and other farm animals are for the most part incapable of living any other way than in the care of the humans that ultimately will kill them for food. We can farm humanely, but if we stop farming entirely then what happens to the cows? We just slaughter them all and the species goes extinct? I mean i guess specifically in the cows we might keep some for dairy (although vegans would say thats not ok too), so maybe not entirely extinct just genocided down to a fraction and now kept for milk instead of meat. Is that better than humane farming?


The only real alternative is lab grown meat, and even then we'll have to accept this means the eventual (probably graudal) cull of billions of farm animals and then a severely reduced population as either novelties or for milk production. The introduction of the car did the same to horses.


Seems about right to me, but a lot of vegans dont like to confront the fact that they are ultimately advocating for the near genocide of a species they are supposedly trying to protect.


I mean I'm fine with that prospect as it isn't exactly a comfortable life for them. But I also just would prefer lab grown meat because its more sterile and doesn't lead to antibiotic abuse.


Just quit breeding them.. they are near genocided every day.. give me a break


Don't use a term like genocide if you don't understand it. Fucking disgusting.


Farm animal genocide, or farm animal slavery and torture


I think not existing is better than constant suffering, personally. PETA culls plenty of animals, they get shit for it, but it doesn't actually go against their ethos. Killing can absolutely be considered an "ethical" choice. If PETA spent all their money taking good care of of all the dogs and cats that come into their possession for the rest of their lives, they would quickly have to stop rescuing at all unless they had infinite resources. There are plenty of Vegans who are anti-animal captivity period, which includes farming, zoos, and pets. I'm not even vegetarian, I've just read into their reasoning and found it to make sense when everybody was crowing about PETA killing rescue dogs one day. What do you call rescues who don't cull and take it more animals than they can handle? Hoarders.


> Predation is a natural part of life Mother Nature is an amoral bitch. Parasitic wasp eggs, flesh eating diseases, and extinction-level asteroid impacts are all natural. What is "natural" is a horrible basis for a system of ethics. > We just slaughter them all and the species goes extinct? [...] Is that better than humane farming? It's a hell of a lot better than needlessly relegating generation after generation of living, feeling creatures to lives of torture and slaughter.


Im not using it as a basis for a system of ethics. Im using it to point out that for lesser evolved animals there isnt an alternative to the predator-prey cycle. I have already come out against factory farming. Are you defining small family farm style livestock raising as "a life of torture and slaughter"?


> Im using it to point out that for lesser evolved animals there isnt an alternative to the predator-prey cycle. Okay, but it is an alternative for *us*. We are capable of comprehending the suffering and harm we are inflicting, and we are capable of *not doing that*. If killing and eating another living, feeling creature is necessary to survive, that's just life. If you kill and eat another living, feeling being because it tastes good, that's just being a dick. It all comes down to the simple question of whether or not you value a sandwich over an animal's life. >Are yoy defining small family farm style livestock raising as "a life of torture and slaughter"? Just cause it's better than the absolute horror show that is factory farming doesn't make it okay. A kick to the balls is a hell of a lot better than getting stabbed in the dick, but they both suck if you're on the receiving end.


I see what you are saying. I think at a basic level we just have a different appreciation for animal life. Im a dog owner and would go a long way to protect and shelter my little buddy from harm. But i dont extend that level of familiarity and affection for the squirrel that destroys my roof, or the deer that jumps in front of my car putting my life in danger. Some animals lot in life is to live, die and be consumed by other animals and im ok with that. Im ok when the wolf kills the deer on the Discovery channel and im ok when i clean and cook fish fresh caught from a stream. I see it all as a part of the natural cycle of life. Again, factory farms are something else entirely, but i do believe ethical farming is possible and probably preferable to the extinction of domesticated food animals that have been with us for thousands of years.


You're talking about "natural" again as if that somehow absolves you of your personal choices. You step back, say "Well, that's just the way things are," and willfully ignore that every single animal you eat, you do so because of *your personal choice*. This is about your choices as an individual and the perfectly viable options you willfully chose to ignore for no other reason than your short-lived pleasure. How do you have any moral standing to condemn others' treatment of animals if you already accept inflicting suffering and death on them is acceptable for your own pleasure?


My favourite thing about these people is they assume that human society as it stands now could exist without animal protein. I'd be fucked. My body can't absorb enough iron from non haeme-sources. Essentially what these people are saying is they value the assumed anthropomorphising of the animals they give a shit about is worth more than me. Fuck riiiiiight off, to all of them.


I do agree with some of what they have to say. Im just not sold on the idea that all predation is inherently immoral and should be stopped. All of evolution is a story of things eating other things or avoiding being eaten. We only exist as we are as a byproduct of this natural arms race of predator and prey. The cows they are defending exist the way they are as a byproduct of a domestically altered evolutionary path to make them more suited to the job of feeding humans. They are at this point so dependent that they would shortly cease to exist if we quit caring for them, which we surely would do if they stopped serving a purpose. Their absolutist stance seems childlike in its black and white painting of reality. And like most childlike insight it contains some truth (animals have feelings too) and a bunch of other less true things like you illustrated.


Zoos, maybe. But I want 3D printed meat for environmental reasons mostly.


I don’t understand why you think that never being born at all is worse than living a life of torture that ends in a terrifying death.


I believe that you can farm animals without needing a life of torture which is why i spoke out against factory farms. All living things die, and most things are scared when it comes.


The reality is that 99% of farmed animals are raised in factory farm conditions, your beliefs have nothing to do with it. So you think that those billions of animals should continue to be bred into a life of suffering because…Other animals suffer too? That’s a really weak argument.


Which is why i advocated in the post you are responding to for changing those conditions through regulation. I dont think any animals should be bred "into a life of suffering" as you seem to define it. Why the strawman?


Something being natural doesn't mean it's good, and bad things happening doesn't mean we have the right to also perpetuate them. Nothing forces us to slaughter cows, even if meat farming were to stop. Keeping even a pretty large population around for its own sake wouldn't cost that much.


When you figure out a humane way to kill a creature that doesn't want to die, let me know. Until then, all you're doing is trying to justify something you _know_ is wrong.


Is hunting wrong in your world view? Are natural predators all monsters that should be driven to extinction? We have a fundamental disagreement on morality that you are trying to paint as cognitive dissonance.


Of course hunting is wrong, if it's unnecessary for survival. It really comes down to that. If you can survive without taking sentient lives but choose not to, for exactly one reason "it tastes good" then you're in the wrong. It's that simple.


I need to eat to survive. I want to eat meat because as an omnivore i have a natural drive to do so. So instead of a wolf or cougar hunting down and eating a deer, i do it. The deer was dead either way, and im absolutely using its meat for my survival. Why am i wrong? If im not, what about if i use my higher cognitive abilities to instead trap a few deer and keep them in a particular area to be culled later as i get hungry. Now what about if i feed these deer and make sure to get a mix of males and females and keep enough that they breed faster than i consume them. Now replace deer with cow. Farming is just hunting with different steps.


You could survive, and thrive, without doing any of that. And comparing yourself to a literal wild animal isn't making the point you think it is.




I've literally never lived "in the city" and my graduating class was 17 people. I am born and raised sticks, chief. This is what happens when you make ignorant assumptions.


> for exactly one reason "it tastes good" then you're in the wrong. It's that simple. Nah, I like eating a healthy diet.


Okay but at the same time its not surprising in the least. Horrific shit happens everyday. People don't care because biologically we're capable of compartmentalizing that emotional disturbance.


Just wait till you watch nature documentaries and learn that it isn’t like Disney movies. I won’t spoil it for you cuz I want it to be a surprise.


Havnt eaten meat in over a decade and it’s to the point where I don’t think I ever could again.


Thank you for your service. BTW, nobody gives a fuck, vegan. This is why you people had to rebrand things as "plant based." Everyone hates proselytizing vegans.


This is the kind of comment that turns people *away* from veganism.


> This is your brain on cognitive dissonance. Not really


It’s easy to not think about it in our neatly packaged ugly stuff out of the way world, but every burger you eat is due to the death of the cow you played with and grew to care about.


Not at all. I played with my cattle and gave them a great life. Then for some of them that life ended suddenly. That's why they existed.


They don't exist for you, no being exists for you. What a crazy world view. I'm sure slaveowners thought they gave their slaves a great life too. Cows live to be 20 years naturally, the beef and dairy industry has them see 4 years if they aren't confined from birth to become veal because there's a taste for dead baby. Yeah you're making a real positive impact on cows' lives.


>They don't exist for you, no being exists for you You're a crazy person. They absolutely had lives for me. I cried when some went to slaughter. But at the end of the day that's literally why they existed. It's not like we feed cattle out of charity. I slaughtered a ton of chickens one day; I made sure they felt no unnecessary pain, but OTOH by that evening they were meat for the needy and homeless. Not a bad day's work with a flooring knife. Somebody's got to do it, may as well do it right and right where they live. You're just a zealot. I've seen your type before, and you go ahead and spin your little wheels. You'll never amount to nothing, nor will your movement.


I'm a crazy person? You're the one who is masturbating bulls and sticking your hand up cows butts so they can get pregnant, then rip their babies away once they're born (to the duress of their moms) so you can drink another species' lactation. Pretty gross dude. Keep confining animals to where they can't move so their meat is tender because your one meal is more important than their lifetime of suffering. Nobody has to do it, there are alternatives. You lack ethics dude, and you are completely delusional if you think you are some kind of steward for these animals.


I certainly took part in artificial insemination. It's not quite as traumatic as you'd paint it (cows have horizontal "tracts" and don't really worry as much about retention). My cattle were never confined and I have never had anything to do with that type of farming. And you can go suck it if you didn't think I was a good steward for these animals. Years later I rode onto a ranch's property and one of my old heifers ran out of the herd to get her pets. I loved all of my cows, even the ones that ended up as ribeyes.


I was about to respond with a strong disagreement but I just googled it and holy *cow*… apparently cows are pretty smart 😯


They're my favorite animals. Absolutely massive, hyper intelligent dogs. The have been shown to have best friends in other cows, sometimes even other species, and they greive for their dead. If you keep googling, you'll just keep finding amazing evidence of their intelligence.


No more eating cows for me


Do you have anything supporting this? I'd really like to read more.


Interesting take. I have worked with both cows and dogs and let me tell you, one seems brighter than the other. Do you have any sources I could look into?


[Here is a good source](https://southpark.cc.com/video-clips/onl6rf/south-park-moo-moo-moo)


> Far more intelligent and emotionally complex than dogs at least. This says more about the dog breeds you've been around than about cows. Cows are plenty smart, but many dog breeds are just as smart and emotionally complex, we just bred quite a bit of it out of a number of breeds to make them more useful and more obedient for us.


Honestly working dogs are insanely smart. There aren’t exactly entire jobs we’d trust a cow to do unsupervised like we can dogs.


I raised beef cattle and I love(d) them. I agree and disagree about cows. They certainly are emotional creatures and take pleasure in simply pleasurable activities (which crows do but possums do not): play. I had a steer that would push his entire head underwater, then blow bubbles out his nostrils just for fun looking back and forth at them. He'd then pop his head out of the water, blow water out his nose, shake his head with delight and do it again. He was a wonderfully cute steer. Even subtracting my anthropomorphism, that is clearly an animal at play. However u/Jaytalvapes, I'm not sure they are more intelligent or emotionally complex than a dog. I would like to hear some of your examples (and I have the most open of minds — my girls were my pets in many ways),


Are you sure about this?


If we can contain their manure, we can reduce greenhouse gas production and maybe make something useful out of it, like biodiesel or something.


This has been available for over a decade. But poop doesn’t make people rich. The push back I saw from GWB when a relative tried to replace gasoline and natural gas with a plant, that’s a few million to built to start… yeah, they weren’t interested at all. It was just a damn shame how greed always goes.


I think cow manure is already used as fuel for ethanol plants. Ethanol plants will get built near feedlots for cheap fuel.


Methane, hydrogen sulfide and carbon monoxide. And nitrous oxide. Biogas. Ethanol plants are near corn plants which are often close to feed lots. My husband also works at a plants that gathers ethanol from natural gas before it can be released into the atmosphere.


It’s seriously unfortunate for cows and pigs how tasty their flesh is.


Careful with that edge, little one.


So true. I honestly think we should be eating toddlers instead


Because we eat them we have to "dehumanize" them for lack of a better word. Dogs are our pets so whenever we see articles about dog farms closing in Asian countries we celebrate it even though cows are pretty hard to take care of in the SEA climates so they went with the next best thing so why should we judge them.


At last my dream of having a house cow will become a reality. The only question left is where do I fit the litter box.


I believe you mean, the litter shed.


That could be anyone's cow crap silo!


A Canadians dream is to have the House Hippo


So they can slaughter their enemies?


Canadians sure are a violent lot eh?


No hippos. They're the number one man killer of humans in Africa by a large animal.


Yeah but the Canadians are the one who want tactical assault Hippos in their homes... If I owned a house Jaguar and I invited you over and it ate part of your head, you wouldn't blame the Jaguar would you?


Yes I would! I'm from Texas and we already have a tiger problem! Blame can wait, avoiding mauling is more important.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLG2JP0P5JE house hippo


Yessssss. Still want one!


I remember watching those ads back in the day, I thought those existed for years. The ad totally flew over my head as a kid.


I also watched them as a kid. I still want one at 29 years old.


North American house hippo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLG2JP0P5JE


Its less a litter box and more of a massive drain in the floor with a grate over top.


Our studies also show that toddlers can reduce training times when cattle prods are leveraged.


Source? Mine just cried a lot.


I used it to train mine to sleep longer! It’s been 2 days and he still hasn’t made a peep.


And which police department do you work for? I’m looking for a new job.


You might be joking, but there are a ton of scientists and parents who use actual cattle prods on children. It is mainly to stop autistic children who engage in potentially dangerous self injury. It is horrific and unethical for the practice to continue, but some people say it works really well. I mean I would definitely stop doing what I was doing if I was hit with a cattle prod too. Doesn’t make it a good solution https://tucson.com/news/science/health-med-fit/parents-want-to-continue-shock-treatment-with-cattle-prod-on-autistic-son-mainstream-doctors-call/article_e35ee97d-b4a2-503b-9c5b-45acea20a0d7.html


Oh this is interesting. I struggled with similar self harm issues and would scratch myself when I was angry or overwhelmed and my parents would respond by physical consequence like punching/slapping or screaming. Sure helped.


I wonder if this is one of those "deeply unpleasant but necessary" things you hear about. Obviously being shocked with a prod is a horrible experience, but is it a **less** horrible, safer experience than the alternative methods of bringing self harming behaviour under control. I've never been in the situation of having to manage this kind of behaviour on an ongoing basis. I can't imagine how traumatic it must be for all involved. Before I get lynched, I'm not defending the practice. It sounds horrible. I just know sometimes horrible things are the best we can do, because the alternatives are worse.


Cows have always seemed very aware of their surroundings, and intuitive. They work latches, find useful ways to scratch, all kinds of signs they are pretty good at reasoning,


I read latches as "lathes" and thought you were shitting on machinists and calling them cows


Of course cows use lathes. How else would they make their [tools?](http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-sebJ2ghSjT4/UCNTfUPACYI/AAAAAAAAARM/QGlbroVihmM/s400/2006-11-27_142614_cow_tools.jpg)


Some fun cow facts: they have best friends, have cow “accents”, recognize and remember peoples faces, and get depressed if kept alone


Then we should definitely factory farm cows


I can just imagine a situation where you invite a friend over and they walk into the bathroom to find an unflushable dry gigaturd horrifyingly sitting in the bowl.


That can happen even if you don't have any cows.


I've been known to drop a gigaturd on occasion after Thanksgiving dinner. This is a cow. That's at LEAST a teraturd, if not a petaturd.


Nah Texas toilets could swallow those turds. I’ve dropped some toddler sized dumps in toilets after getting blocked up by MREs. The only toilets who could handle such abominations were in Texas.


Do they close the lid and wash their hooves?


Children don't, so I call that a draw


To be fair though, toddlers are fucking idiots.


To be really fair, though, we train them to sit in their own shit, THEN we try to train them to shit in the toilet. People of all ages are fucking idiots


Yep, probably one of the reasons it's often easier to potty train younger kids than older ones. Get them before they really understand what the diaper is doing


They'll end up back in the diaper in 70 years, so why bother changing out of them?


I have yet to see one come out and run across a field... lazy little bastards.


>This produces two problematic substances: nitrate and nitrous oxide. Can we teach these cows to drag race?


Or package whippits


I bet if we didn't have disposable diapers, we would be teaching babies to use the potty much quicker. [Quick google search](https://www.salon.com/2010/07/09/extreme_potty_training/) shows other countries are able to train their kids before 2 years.


This explains some office bathrooms I've been in


Cows are smart, maybe we shouldn’t treat them so badly


Finally OP's mom learned to use the toilet


Stop eating cows. Start eating toddlers.


semi-related... the way they handle cow shit at dairy farms is disgusting. there was a literal river of cow shit flowing to a shit waterfall... the smell was insane.


The worst part about that is, all that literal shit is highly valuable. Our farms are so inefficient we can't capture any of it. All that shit is grade A fertilizer. It's packed full of energy. It can also be a power source. All that poop could go into a bioreactor. Gases could be captured and repurposed. We just don't do any of it because it's more complicated and most small farms can't invest into the equipment. All big corp animal husbandry operations should have enforced regulations on capturing their waste and keeping it out of the environment. We trade cheap beef now for a unsustainable polluted river system forever.


Didn’t even think of that; we complain about top soil erosion and the limited number of remaining planting seasons… but you’re right, that shit is gold.


What if your big Mac box said "This was Dolly. She liked to play and tried to be a good girl. She learned to go potty to make her farmer happy" I just can't any more.


As mom of a toilet training resistant toddler, I feel like any thing could be trained faster than a toddler


Or we could just stop mass-producing cattle unnecessarily


Yeah, I love meat as much as the next guy, but I find it stunning how the response isn't "cows are smart, maybe we shouldnt treat them so badly" but rather: cows are smart, now we can exploit them more effectively. I get it. Our food culture revolves around meat, and I'm probably eating beef this evening, but I wouldn't mind a bit more self reflection as a society.


My issue is that we don’t *need* meat to survive as humans. It’s not water or oxygen. Humans *choose* to eat meat for any infinite number of reasons or justifications. And now we’ve gotten to a point in human history that we’ve realized mass animal production is undisputedly destroying the environment and we do a number of things to try and mitigate that but really don’t make a dent in the problem.


I look forward to lab grown meat


Of course, cows have bigger brains than toddlers.




So theoretically cows could be trained to deposit of their waste within some sort of technology that eliminates the byproduct problem? I’d much rather we just eliminate the entire industrial cattle farming industry though. The tech is outdated and to propagate this system is a moral travesty, when we could create a vastly better one if we only willed it so.


News like this is why after eating meat for over 3 decades I’ve finally gone vegetarian. It’s actually been pretty easy so far. I don’t really miss meat. I’d like to go full vegan at some point in the future.


Good on you! I haven’t eaten beef/pork in 4ish years and I’ve been pescatarian for almost 3. It gets easier and easier with time!!!


And they're vaccinated, so they can learn


Vaccinated *and* potty trained? These cows are smarter than roughly a quarter of the American electorate.


Man, I was excited for a second because I read crows.


Crows can outperform us all!


I’m not surprised. You ever meet a toddler?. They’re so dumb


If only people could learn to not kill them.


If only cows would learn to not be so delicious


This seems like a waste when the better mega-dairies already squeegee the manure into floor drains, where it os whisked away along with soiled sand bedding to the manure processing plant by a flume system or augers. Heavy equipment separates out, sand. It is washed, bleached to kill off bacteria, stacked up in piles to drain and dry, then reused for bedding The remaining manure slurry has the liquids strained out to thicken it, and it is sent off to the digester. There, special bacteria are added, along with other nutrients to break down the manure and capture as much biogas as possible. This gas is compressed into liquid and hauled in purpose-built trailers to the pipeline injection site. The pipeline carries it to California for use in biogas-powered fleet vehicles. The spent manure is pumped back to the farm, where it is then sent through screw presses to strain out the remaining dry, stackable solids. These are much better for fertilizer than undigested manure, and are sold as such Going back to the liquid side of things, the liquid that is strained out to thicken the digester-bound slurry is then cycled back out through the flumes to collect more sand and manure into the system. “Brown water” is used multiple times to facilitate separation in the manure processing facility. The final post-digested liquid manure that runs out of the screw presses is collected and pumped out into a massive rubber bladder that occupies a concrete pit. When these bladders fill every month or so, the liquid manure is pumped into trucks and spread on farm fields to recover the nutrients. Any runoff of digested liquid manure is lower in water contaminates than the raw stuff, so it is gentler on ecosystems. Needless to say, milking 5,000 cows uses a lot of electricity and burns a lot of diesel, and they drink a lot of water, way more than a person. You would not believe the amount of corn that must be farmed, harvested, and stacked for silage to keep them fed. It is a massive undertaking, and the supply chain and service contracts are a sizable chunk of a local economy. The flow meter from the rotary parlor shows a mind boggling amount of milk, and a few tanker trucks are filled each day. The bigger operators are vertically integrated and their milk is hauled to their own cheese factories. This way they are not held captive by fluctuating milk prices.


Considering animals of similar intelligence are easily trained to hold it in until the right place, doesn't this simply mean that farmer's don't care to train cows?


Fine. I’m going to train my toddler to be a vegan


Perhaps the best argument for not eating them I’ve seen.


Well, then they’re smarter than a toddler.


Hmm, smarter than human children. Maybe we shouldn’t be eating those.


I work at a zoo and our cows are devious critters. But they learned which bowl is theirs in two days and not to bash the gate in like three. This was all with positive reinforcement, mainly neck scratches. Also, they seem to poop in the same place on their own. I love cows!!


I worked with this investigator on a different project. The practice of behavioural technologies to enhance the ways we train animals and humans is quite underdeveloped and we could do so much more in this area. It’s basically hacking the software of the brain to be more efficient and more creative. People focus so much on the hardware that we forget that the programming is also very important.


Please stop eating animals. You don't need to eat them to be healthy. Their capacity to suffer is much the same as you or me. What we do to them for the sake of a 5 minute sandwich is unkind and unjust.


How about you learn to stop exploiting animals??


I heard that some cultures never use diapers, they train their infants from birth. If that's possible, any toddler should be able to get it. As I understand it, since the babies in those cultures never get used to crapping in their own pants, they don't delay pooping where they are supposed to and nowhere eles.


But we'll still kill them in the billions just because, FUCK you


Now do masks! I bet they can learn how to wear one faster than a middle aged country bumfuck!




Does that make it ok to eat the vast number of people that can't?


No, we need a sustainable breeding population. We can only eat a few at a time.


> The more urine we can capture, the less we’ll need to reduce cattle numbers to meet emissions targets – and the less we’ll have to compromise on the availability of milk, butter, cheese and meat from cattle. Their goal is to continue to have plenty of meat to eat.


If you're in the meat industry - I'd rather you increase sustainability than fight climate related policies.


Isn't that what they're doing?


For me, the bar is that a creature is too smart to eat when it can pass the mirror test, solve puzzles (not just mazes), or demonstrate some sort of theory of mind (the understanding that what you know is not the same as what I know). This puts the bar for me somewhere around raccoons and lower cephalapods. Cows are just below that bar. Pigs are just above that bar. I will still occasionally eat pig or octopus, but generally only when it is given to me without me asking because I'd feel like letting them die in vain would be worse than eating them.


Don't dogs fail the mirror test?


Smart. Almost like we shouldnt be eating them. Toddlers on the other hand....


Pigs would learn even faster.


They already did learn, and they said "F-it, these bastards didn't even give me a single square to wipe with, let alone hands. They can clean my shit-stained ass when they murder me."


Toilet train them before slicing their throats open. Or dragging them off for slaughter cause they can’t produce that white gold any more. Yeah, really cool !!!


Or the poor downed cows who get tortured to stand and walk for slaughter- everyone needs to watch those videos as they eat their dead animals.


Of course it is. It protects the environment. But maybe you're not much concerned about environment issues




I mean alright but then what's your take ? Forbid steak and hunt down meat eater with a shotgun ? Prohibition just doesn't work. So alongside a work to reduce meat consumption, a harm-reduction system sounds reasonable. Sure, it would be better if everybody stopped eating meat tomorrow. And even better if cars suddently use free endless energy. But until that, you can't blame people for trying others solutions. Reduction the environmental impact of meat. Using electric cars. Using nuclear energy instead of coal. That kind of stuff.


I’m a huge fan of beef, but I cut back to eating it about once a week instead of every day. (It also saves me a bit of money) Food scientists are working on making 3D printed steaks… hopefully with time it’ll taste as good as the real thing. We’re probably only 5-10 years away from that being a reality… so that’s probably the best option. They’re also “growing” cloned steaks… in theory it should be 100% exactly the same as a real steak. It’s functionally already working, just expensive as it’s not up to a manufacturing scale yet. So I’m thinking we keep the beef industry the way it is, no changes, and wait for these competing “beef” products to be released at scale. Then we let the free market naturally work itself out.


Maybe not breeding them would be even better on the environment and would also stop the extra money and resources needed to go into ‘training’ cows to shit and piss on demand.


Copy pasting what I just said to the other guy : I mean alright but then what's your take ? Forbid steak and hunt down meat eater with a shotgun ? Prohibition just doesn't work. So alongside a work to reduce meat consumption, a harm-reduction system sounds reasonable. Sure, it would be better if everybody stopped eating meat tomorrow. And even better if cars suddently use free endless energy. But until that, you can't blame people for trying others solutions. Reduction the environmental impact of meat. Using electric cars. Using nuclear energy instead of coal. That kind of stuff. ​ I guess if the perfect solution can't be used, you just refuse to do anything


To be honest, that sounds like a cop out. I guess when you buy your meat or drink your milk you’ll look for packaging that states these cows shit in a toilet making it better for the environment. The single, best way to do something about it rather than nothing about it is to choose not to put your money into that disgusting system of animal agriculture. And the important word there is ‘choose’. You have a choice, and if you realize that animal agriculture has a negative impact on the environment, then it’s a simple choice.


Sigh, another almighty vegan talking about animal cruelty. I'm talking environment. What *I* do is irreverant. It's about what *everyone* does. Imagine if you will. The government now demands that methods is adopted by every meat industry. That mean no more animal caged all their lives. Because, you know, they want walk in or out the toilet. Less soil polution. That's costly, it raise meat's cost without making it impossible to buy, reducing its consomption and its environment impact. And there's you, guilting people into not buying meat. Frustrating them and making them want to eat more meat out of spite, like there was more people drinking during prohibition. Who's the most efficient at making a better world one step at the time ?


I haven’t tried to guilt you into anything, I said you have a choice. And yes, my path started with animal cruelty, that is my primary reason for being vegan, but because of how the animal agriculture industry operates, what an incredibly huge ‘monster’ it is, it destroys the environment, you know, the topic you say I’m not talking about, while abusing said animals, so they are in effect tied together. So by simply choosing not to eat meat and buy into that industry, you are helping the environment, helping abused animals and doing a world of god for your health. Not sure about your math but 3 out of 3 seems pretty good to me. What you are wanting is for other people to do this kind of thing for you so you don’t have to, and you are wrong, what YOU do is very relevant. You make choices every day about how you live your life, why not try to make the best choices possible ????


Ah now we are Going to train billions of cows instead of just stop breeding the poor animals . Imbecils


While this is a great achievement I don't like the comparison. Human babies/toddlers are notoriously underdeveloped (because the head still has to fit through the mother, human babies are born in a pretty early stage). So beating a toddler isn't really a big achievement, while the study on itself is.